In his latest demonstration of fiscal idiocy, Barack Obama has proposed an irresponsible new policy with utterly ridiculous and immature features. I’ll give you three examples of the sheer stupidity of his new proposals, but first I want you to be clear on a few terms:
Borrower - this is a person who has taken out a mortgage loan
Investor - this is a person or company whose money was used to fund a borrower’s loan
Loan Servicer - this is a company that collects payments and interacts with borrowers on behalf of investors
Note that loan servicers don’t really have “skin in the game” - they’re simply a paperwork processing service.
So here are 3 examples of Obama’s latest stupid policy proposals:
- Bribe Loan Servicers to execute mortgage modifications by giving them $1,000 per modification
- Bribe Loan Servicers even more by giving them an additional $1,000 per year for up to 3 years if the Borrower stays current
- Bribe Borrowers to unnecessarily modify mortgages by giving them $1,500 if they have their mortgage modified before they are in default!!!!!!
This is SHEER STUPIDITY, my friends. Obama is proving how much of an economic and intellectual lightweight he is each time he opens his mouth.
In typical socialist fashion, Obama is disregarding the rights of private property owners (mortgages are private property owned by investors) by bribing loan servicers to modify mortgages that they don’t own. Remember - Loan Servicers do not own the loans they service, they merely manage the interactions with the Borrower.
This will cause an avalanche of lawsuits as Investors choose to defend their rights against the increasingly tyrannical policies of the government of the United States of America.
But the real kicker is Obama’s attempt to bribe Loan Servicers into executing mortgage modifications for loans that are not even in default! Yes, that’s right: Obama wants to steal money from you - in the form of higher taxes which he’s already committed to raising - and use that money to give your neighbors (many of whom never actually genuinely qualified for their loans to begin with) a lower mortgage payment.
Let me reiterate: Obama wants to lower mortgage payments for people who aren’t even in default. Your money will pay the mortgages of your neighbors who are not facing financial difficulty.
This is disgusting. It is utterly irresponsible, and demonstrates that Obama is an extreme socialist, moving this country as quickly towards Marxist principles as he can.
It’s time to fight back. Call your congressman and senators. Call the White House. Tell them you’re sick of this garbage. It’s astounding that the United States has survived and thrived economically since the late 1700’s, and has been able to effectively recover from each major (and normal) economic downturn without the federal government’s massive involvement, but then politicians like FDR, Carter, Clinton, Bush and Obama decide that the economy can’t do what it has always done, and heal itself.
The arrogance is palpable, and so is the idiocy. Obama, you’re a fool.
As always, your comments are welcomed here at RealEstate.BryanEllis.com.












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42 Comments So Far»
I totally agree with your comments, Bryan. I am really worried with the present administration and how they are trying to accomplish their socialist agendas. I hope people wake up and smell the “coffee” before it is too late.
Bryan ,
What do you really think???
Good job of pointing out the nonsence going on on capitol hill. The next thing you know we will all be standing on lines waiting for our government cheese, Yum. Its a sorry state of affairs..
Unfortunately, it is a done deal. There is no one that speaks for us in Washington D.C. The Republicans do not have a backbone. No one is calling him out and speaking loud enough. The democrats (Socialists) are organized and united in their purpose and have been working toward this for several years even decades.
The conservatives are finally starting to wake up but they are not mobilizing fast enough. We are coming late to this game. If we do not start campaigning hard for 2010 and be willing to take drastic action to turn this around, we will never recover. We need to recognize that the Socialist would go so far as to even re-write the constitution if they have to to solidify their hold on America for life. They would even stage a terrorist attack if it would create an opportunity to seize more power over our lives which is the exact thing they accused Bush for doing for the last eight years.
At any rate, we need more than just a few phone calls. We need to fight fire with fire. We need to start mobilizing at a community level to mobilize our base and explain the effects of Socialism to offset the billions they are pouring into their community efforts. People are starting to suspect something but we have to do more. The media is 100% in his pocket. Thanks for a great article.
Since ancient times there have been people that want to be led so they don’t have to be responsible for the consequences of the choices they make. These people tend to go about their days in total oblivion, spiritually speaking, and focus more on being entertained, gratified, and avoiding being responsible for themselves and their community of humankind. Watch people in parking lots at supermarkets, etc throwing trash on the ground and leaving their shopping carts in parking spaces, etc. “Let someone else do it” and “what’s in it for me?” is the modern attitude and it isn’t just Americans.
The puppetmasters own the major media and have intentionally brainwashed & dumbed down the people in our country and some others. We are very close to becoming a “One World Order” and responsible people will lose more freedoms while the others believe they are being provided for. “Let someone else do it” has gotten us where we are because it’s too much trouble to get involved in working to RESTORE THE REPUBLIC. The Money Masters (puppetmasters) have created this attitude in more and more of us by corrupting the minds of our youth in more ways than most would believe. Obama was put into office by these “One Worlders” and he will do their bidding very successfully.
One has to go underground for the TRUTH, like on the internet and sites that talk about this while encouraging us to ACT instead of just talk. Americans must UNITE and fight or allow what was created as a Republic (not a democracy) to become just another region in a Communist style One World Order.
Who cares enough to get involved in stopping it? W.G. Reau
While I’m not a big proponent of the “conspiracy theory” angle, fundamentally, I’m with you
— Bryan Ellis
where were you when this big mess was created during the last 10 years?
There’s a history much longer than 10 years. The roots are much deeper. The immediate mortgage crisis has its roots in the Carter administration, and the bigger socialist agenda had its biggest national introduction under FDR. — Bryan Ellis
Bryan, unfortunately, people don’t learn the lessons and when they begging to “get it”, is most of the times too late. I don’t think that the Americans voters took seriously the treat of socialism been forced upon the American people. We can expect more of the same!
Hey Bryan,
First, let me just say thanks for everything you’ve been doing through your web site, including not holding back on how you feel about certain issues. I allso respect the fact that you give everyone a chance to agree or disagree.
As far as I’m concerned, you are RIGHT ON! Obama is taking us down the road to Socialism. As a real estate investor, I have NO sympathy for Banks, and crooked lawyers, or politicians. ZERO!
I’m constanly looking for new stratagies to out smart the fox! For the most part, you have always propmoted only the very best information on this site and it is very much appritiated.
To anyone reading this….Constant Education is critical to staying a step ahead of those who seek to steel from us.
Bryans site is the perfect place to do that!
DON
Thanks Don, your check is in the mail!
(Just kidding!) — Bryan Ellis
wagreen, are you for real. Do you people even know what socialism is? I came from a country that had a socilaist government years ago, you have no idea what a true a socialist government is. People wake up and smell the corruption. Over the last eight years there was the biggest shift in wealth in the history of the world. The middle class, those people that get up and go to work every morning for a paycheck, those people that try to save for a rainy day and retirement, have watched their next eggs evaporate. The people we need to hold accountable are these greedy financial fat cats, they are the ones eating up the all the cash in this country. People need to realize, we have had a oneway street in this counrty for quite sometime now, but not the way you may beleive. The ones getting all the breakes are the rich.
Wehave had eight long years of poor policies, which led us to where we are now, lets give this guy a chance, he may suprise us.
As for all those crying the blues about this attempt at repairing the mortgage industry, to you I say this. Where was all the belly aching when Bush handed out money like it was candy to all the big banks, with no strings attached, we still have no idea where that money went. Now Obama, is trying to put the money where it will make as difference and eveyone is crying the blues. Remember, if you stabalize the real estate market everyone benefits with housing prices stabalizing. I would love to invest in some real estate, I just refuse to do it at someone else misfortune. It is about time we stop this selfishness and start working together, to get through this.
One last thought, it is not, contrary to the belive of many the rich that make an economy improve. It is the masses, when they go out and spend. If we keep taking from the middle class, they will have nothing left to spend. For you rich folks out there, stop being so greedy, you do not spend enough to help this economy, in many cases you don’t even pay enough taxes to support this government, you would rather spend the money on tax attoneys, figuring how to get out of paying your fare share of taxes, hence the reason why a flat tax is still not in place.
It all comes down to this. There are two types of lazy people: Dumb and Intelligent. Since neither of the two believe in achievement they formed a team called “BSOE” (Blame SomeOne Else). And they have mastered this game to an art.
As a man who grew up with little it always would amaze me that the people who could less afford kids would have numerous children.
And if you chose not to participate in this madness people looked at you as though you were crazy.
So I am now 45 years old and I am not surprised that Obama became president.
It is just sad that Dr. king name was used to promote “A Wolf In Sheep Clothing”.
Bryan, I believe that your comments are more true than most will believe. I just finished watching a 3 video series called COMMANDING HEIGHTS. It goes back into the history of the world and shows the troubles Governments cause by Socialism or Marxist type rule. It uncovers how a Capitalistic society always straightens itself out. (The Mystery of Capitalism) It is a must see to understand where we are headed. What continues to happen in the world is what i call the “Grandfather, Father, Son Theory” history is doomed to repeat itself. We do not learn from our Grandfathers only our Fathers. Thanks always for the timely and great info.
Norm
Thank you, CMGA64. I can’t believe that the people who supported the policies that got us into this mess in the first place, expect us to listen to them now. Do you really expect Obama to let us continue to spiral down into another great depression taking the whole world with us? We’re sick of tax breaks for Paris Hilton and subsidies for Exxon Mobil. We voted for a government FOR the people, and voted out government for the rich people. 53 million of us voted for change. We don’t care if you call us names, like socialists or liberals. Name calling doesn’t mean anything. We voted for truth, justice, prosperity and healthcare for all (not just a few). YES, WE CAN!
As a Christian, I didn’t vote for Obama, for obvious reasons. As an African-American, I didn’t vote for him, because of what Martin Luther King Jr. said about judging a man based on the content of his character, not based on race. I know a phony when I see one (the emperor has no clothes!). I didn’t need anyone else telling me what Obama would do to “change” this country because it was clear as a bell that he is a socialist ideologue who is going to use the power of government to literally destroy 200+ years of democracy (as we know it) before the end of his 4-year term, as well as enact policies that will solidify his party’s control over the electorate for years to come, using this “economic crisis” as a means of accomplishing this task. How in the world a majority of the American people could vote for this man is still a mystery to me, even to this day?
You can expect more of the same sort of nonsense to start coming down the road once he’s put all his “economic” policies into place, including destroying the banking system (nationalizing the banks), our health care system, piece by piece, by using several pieces of legislation (not in one massive bill like he just did with the economic stimulus bill) to enact his brand of government style “universal” health insurance, just like they snuck in all kinds of “pork” into both the TARP bill and the so-called economic stimulus bill. Then, he’ll turn his attention to the environment and attempt to label carbon dioxide a “toxic gas,” and that’s when the real fun will begin. If you think your taxes are going up now because of the 1.2 trillion dollars he and the Congress just spent, wait until his plans for combatting “global warming” (or is it climate change???) kick in and another trillion (plus) dollars are tacked onto the tax bill owed by us all.
Bryan is right about the genesis of this current global economic crisis going back to the Carter administration with it’s enactment of the Community Reinvestment Act. (For more details, log onto the marklevinshow.com and listen to the archive of the 9/18/08 broadcast.)
When he’s done “changing” this country, he’ll have destroyed our way of life, as we know it. The only way to stop him is if we vote out most of the Congress & 1/3 of the Senate in 2010, and then go on to vote in his replacement in 2012. Hopefully, we can un-do most of the damage that he will have done in the meanwhile.
Well Brian, I’m not sure why I’m posting this comment, since you decided to censor my last comment and not post it. Censorship Brian? Really? That’s shameful. I realize this is your blog, and you can post or not post anything you want, but doesn’t that defeat the purpose of having a blog?
Let me start off by saying that you’re article is inaccurate, as most of your articles tend to be. Most loans in this country are not serviced by independant servicers. They are serviced by the lender that originated the loan. Many lenders sell the servicing on “some” of their loans, but not necessarily on all of them. The biggest lenders, the ones making the majority of the loans, retain the servicing on all of thier loans.
There is a lot of money in servicing, and the larger lenders are able to manage their own loans without outside help. I used to work for one of the large GSEs, so I know what I’m talking about. This was my business. So for you Brian to say that “Loan Servicers do not own the loans they service, they merely manage the interactions with the Borrower”, is largely incorrect. Shame on you for misleading your readers. Or maybe it was just your ignorance showing again.
Also, you’re telling me that Investors are going to sue because a loan modification was worked out on one of their loans? That’s utterly rediculous. No Investor would rather have a loan in foreclosure, when they could work out a modification that keeps the payments coming in. Where do you get this stuff Brian? You should stick to writing about things that you know about. Whatever that might be.
So you also think it would be best to wait until a borrower is in default before his loan is modified, rather than be proactive about the situation? Is that how you handle your own personal finances? You wait until your back is against the wall before you decide to do anything about the situation? I doubt it. You just want your neighbor to do that. Some neighbor you are.
Brian, this is the most idiotic article that you ever posted. It’s so full of holes, lies and propaganda, that I could barely stand to read it. Your readers deserve better. Unfortunately they’ll probably never learn the truth, because I’m sure you’ll place this post “Under moderation”, like you did my last post.
My dear readers: Anthony is a curious study, as he tends to make a lot of long and rambling posts that contain not a shred of fact - much like a recent one he wrote, which was meant for little more than to incite racial strife. I didn’t publish it, nor do I apologize for not publishing it. Anthony wrote to me privately and called me a coward, to which I respond: The wisdom to avoid the spreading of foolishness does not a coward make.
But for the benefit of everyone’s entertainment, I’ve decided to publish this classic piece of brainless commentary from Anthony. Note - it’s not brainless because it disagrees with me, but because it fails to have any basis in actual reality. I’ll respond to it soon - and frankly, it will be easy to cut these arguments to shreds - but before I do so, I’ll leave an opportunity for my valued readers to state their cases. Agree with me? Agree with Anthony? Let’s hear it! — Bryan Ellis
Good thing you put Bush in that hand basket to hell too, Bryan…proves there’s hope for you yet. But you took the wind out my sail because my raging thought up until that point was that Dubya Bush PRINTED well over a trillion dollars to bail out financial giants who were having a good ole time with exorbitant bonuses, splendid galas and multi-million dollar luxury jet purchases even on our dimes while receiving bailout money. Not to mention the oil barons (Bush, Cheney, et al) croneys who were the ultimate winners in a vast land of losers. Yes, I am torn and worried about the financial burden my children and future grandchildren will inherit. But not so torn I don’t understand that the avarice of unbridaled capitalism has made victims out of homeowners who made smart, responsible choices too. I know, both as a real estate broker and informed citizen that EVERY homeowner has been affected by look the other way capitalism. Sadly, it has come to the point that if we can bail out the mega-rich, we can bailout the working poor.
i agree with you Bryan. Anthony you spelled ridiculous wrong. i am tired of people trying to play a race card, Please get over it. I am not a European American i am an American you are not an African American you are an American so as Americans it is time to discuss issues for us as Americans and not be dividing on race. this is funny coming from the dems who say we should be inclusive but still dividing on color. barak is a fool based on facts and decisions not color. bush was a fool in certain decisions not because of his color. it is now time to rise up against these decisions while we still can an move our country to the betterment of all and for our children. Lets start planning to remove this administration by sticking to the facts and not ranting on i don’t get a chance because i am black
Wait. What race card? I didn’t see a single mention of race in Anthony’s last post. Did I miss something?
I agree… thanks Bryan for your endless honestly.
Its interesting that nobody has disagreed.. Many many people are upset in a HUGE way over all of this, and maybe we don’t out number the “sheep” who only want what WG Reau said above but we can make a difference. Glenn Beck is starting a “we are not alone” campaign after so many people called in saying how hopeless and powerless and alone they felt knowing where our country is headed and not being able to do anything. He also has spent a long time reading and studying and talking with scholars about our founding fathers and the history of our nation and the miracle that led to the birth of our Country… and I don’t believe we will let it go down in flames…
I was talking with a client a few days ago and his daughter works for a non-profit education organization. She is in Washington quite a bit and I can’t remember word for word what he said, but in a nut shell, don’t send emails… they get thousands of email and none get read. They do however respond and read hand written letters that are signed by their constituants. Call or write… go to their office and drop the letter off if possible.. go to their web sites and follow what they are doing and how they are voting. It has to start at the local level. We are the ones voting for the Pelosi’s and Barney’s and Dodd’s… lets stop them. Hopefully its not too late.
Gloria
Bryan, you comment is very insightful, although I don’t think that this is part of a socialist agenda. If we want to detect socialism, then we already have socialism for the wealthy in the gigantic bank bailing outs. The fact is that politicians respond to special interests and their lobbiest; I think all Obama is doing is pleasing his masters who put him into power. It’s up to the people to keep things straight by speaking out loud.
I can’t understand this argument at all. I thought that every time a house in your neighborhood was foreclosed on, that means that I can buy that house really cheap. So why would I buy your house? The house next door is a lot cheaper. Doesn’t that decrease the value of your home every time another home is foreclosed on? I thought that was why we needed a bailout in the first place, because this cycle will only continue.
Besided the monetary reasons, what about the humanitarian reasons? How does it help you for families to get kicked out on the street. Famililes include children. What about the families and the children?
I remember now, Jesus was always advocating for taking care of yourself and not worrying about your fellow human being.
And why are you throwing around the word socialism? You don’t seem to mind that we have socialist police and fire departments, socialized libraries and museums, not to mention a socialized public school system. So why can’t we all have health care? And college?
Should I be forced to let my teeth fall out because I don’t have any money to get them fixed? Should I have to die of cancer because I couldn’t afford to go to the doctor for early detection. That’s my fault because I’m poor?
My dad is die-hard right-wing republican but guess what? He’s on social security and is struggling with his mortgage payments. He’s now waiting on his March 4th loan modification courtesy of Obama’s Economic Stimulus Plan! And he didn’t even vote for the guy! But he sure does need a bailout!
I just don’t understand your argument against the bailout, i.e. saving our country. I have to agree with reloanpro that you weren’t worried about your grandchildren’s debt when we invaded an innocent country or when we gave billions to the banks with no oversight. These banks should be nationalized at this point to protect our investment! The banks and Wall Street obviously can’t (or won’t) police themselves, so somebody needs to do it!
cmga64 you’re a blind fool. If you can’t wake up and smell reality and get out of your delusional state of mind then you’re no different then the idiots that voted this moron in office.
Give him a chance give me a break.
This guy is putting this country into a state of Socialism whether you want to believe it or not.
And Anthony you’re the biggest idiot of them of them all. A pathetic idealist with no moral concept of reality. You’re probably the type that says yeah we should support the lazy because you probably are lazy and expect people to bail you out.
Sorry but I can’t stand the Obama supporters they are blind,foolish and ignorant to what this jackass really is.
Dear readers or should I say non-readers,
Bryan stated he didn’t publish a different piece by Anthony that was racially inflammatory. Not the current article, I for one believe Bryon as many of Anthony’s posts are very racially bent.
When Bryan states Anthony’s article is factually bereft, I concur. I have several loans out and a third party services most of them. Can I say most loans are done this way, not as a point in fact, however a huge number are and have been and I can say factually this varies with the monetary climate of the industry.
How many of you have used or heard of a Mortgage Broker? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortgage_broker
Here is a link to describe what they are if you don’t know. It is how most home mortgage loans have been done for the last several years. It was and is the simplest way to find the lowest rate for a mortgage. They have been very prevalent when the industry was hot and disappear when it is not.
Now here is a loan servicer. Let us see how accurate Anthony was?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loan_servicer
Now how many loans have any of you had that didn’t involve a Loan Servicer? I bet very few, why the majority of loans have one of these outfits involved in the loan somewhere. I know Citi Bank and Bank of America both make very heavy use of Loan Servicers. Now that I think of it all the major banks and most banks in general make use of them at some point. So where does Anthony work that this does not happen or maybe he does not understand what the company he works for really does. I tend to think maybe the later is the case.
Most big lenders don’t service the loans they originate; they don’t even really own the loans they originate for the most part. What do people think Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are all about?
Bryan is right on about the Loan Servicers and the Obama administrations short sightedness about what they are doing. There are two choices about what the current administration is doing; they are incredibly stupid with no real understanding of what they are doing. (I think a lot of this is in force right now) or they are very aware of what they are doing and then they are traitors and need to be called such immediately and often. (I think a lot of this is in force right now also.)
The latest idea of the Obamains is going to create a huge problem for everyone. When you have such a large monetary incentive to screw people out of their money by churning loans it will happen.
In the stock market, the practice of “churning” was made illegal and if you are caught doing it you will be prosecuted, (although after Maddof and the latest guy I am less sure about how much the SEC really desires to prosecute anyone). So why is the administration setting up a situation that has a stated goal of doing this very thing?
Between Mark to Market and this latest idiocy in a few months, getting any kind of loan should be nearly impossible!
At the time of this writing I can say the banks are mostly only doing refinance loans and it comes with a large penalty of points and interest rate hit for most borrowers. They are looking to boost their bottom line by doing this and you cannot blame them because it is one way of gaining liquidity.
It makes no sense and actually is monetarily very irresponsible to propose churning home loans for the sake of maybe it will help. What models are these fools using? I have not been able to find a model like this; I cannot find any economist that has merit even supporting a model like this. A loan model developed by tax cheats and lauded by tax cheats does not make me feel very good. We are getting better fortified at my home just in case however.
Footnotes: My information on loan servicing by major lenders comes from several long terms friends with long-term employment at three of the largest banks in this country.
Chris B
P.S. for all that are curious Bryan is spot on with this article!
For all the misslinda2000s out there.
There is a germ of truth to some of what you say, “The banks and Wall Street obviously can’t (or won’t) police themselves, so somebody needs to do it!”
The truth of this is congress has passed many pieces of legislation making it impossible to comply with the law and maintain their charter unless they made a large number of bad loans. Reference the term Redlining and how it relates to the banking industry and how this has altered loans by the banking industry.
The Federal Government has made it illegal to deny many bad loans for home mortgages over the last several years. It has been a long time since banks had a real choice who they gave mortgages out to and whom they denied. If that sounds ridiculous to you then it is about time people started looking into what has really been happening over the last 30 years.
As for invading an innocent country, you have to be kidding! There was nothing innocent about Saddam or Iraq. If you believe it was or even now is so innocent then I suggest you take a few weeks and spend some time in the country. I feel you will come back with a different idea than you currently have. Maybe you won’t but when I see such obviously uniformed statements I always suggest one takes the time to experience something first hand to get a good feel for what reality is.
Here is some information on Socialism for all of the readers, I see much talk about what it is and is not but little accuracy about what it is.
The following is quoted from Wikipedia:
“Socialism refers to a broad set of economic theories of social organization advocating public or state ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods, and a society characterized by equal opportunities for all individuals, with a fair or egalitarian method of compensation.[1][2] Modern socialism originated in the late 19th-century working class political movement, and in an intellectual movement that criticized the effects of industrialization and private ownership on society. Karl Marx posited that socialism would be achieved via class struggle and a proletarian revolution, and would represent a transitional stage between capitalism and communism.[3][4]
The first socialists were termed utopian socialists by later socialist thinkers, and include Robert Owen, who tried to found socialist factories and other structures within a capitalist society and Henri de Saint Simon, the first individual to coin to term “socialism” and the originator of technocracy and industrial planning. The first socialists predicted a world improved by harnessing technology and combining it with better social organization, and many contemporary socialists share this belief.[5][6] Later in the 19th century, Marxist socialism became more dominant. Democratic socialism is socialism by democratic means. Arab Socialism and African socialism are also notable forms of socialism. There is disagreement over the extent that National Socialism is socialist; although Adolf Hitler’s party program included socialist elements, the Nazis did not socialize industry, just created a highly state-regulated welfare state.[7]
Socialists mainly share the belief that capitalism unfairly concentrates power and wealth among a small segment of society that controls capital, creates an unequal society, and does not provide equal opportunities for everyone in society. Therefore socialists advocate the creation of a society in which wealth and power are distributed more evenly based on the amount of work expended, although there is considerable disagreement among socialists over how, and to what extent this could be achieved.
Socialism is not a concrete philosophy of fixed doctrine and program; its branches advocate a degree of social interventionism and economic rationalization, sometimes opposing each other. Another dividing feature of the socialist movement is the split between reformists and the revolutionaries on how a socialist economy should be established. Some socialists advocate complete nationalization of the means of production, distribution, and exchange; others advocate state control of capital within the framework of a market economy. Socialists inspired by the Soviet model of economic development have advocated the creation of centrally planned economies directed by a state that owns all the means of production. Others, including Yugoslavian, Hungarian, Polish and Chinese Communists in the 1970s and 1980s, instituted various forms of market socialism, combining co-operative and state ownership models with the free market exchange and free price system (but not prices for the means of production).[8] Social democrats propose selective nationalization of key national industries in mixed economies and tax-funded welfare programs and the regulation of markets. Libertarian socialism (including social anarchism and libertarian Marxism) rejects state control and ownership of the economy altogether and advocates direct collective ownership of the means of production via co-operative workers’ councils and workplace democracy.”
Now here is a little bit of discussionquoted form Wikipedia:
“Criticism
Main article: Criticisms of socialism
Criticisms of socialism range from claims that socialist economic and political models are inefficient or incompatible with civil liberties to condemnation of specific socialist states. There is much focus on the economic performance and human rights records of Communist states, although there is debate over the categorization of such states as socialist.
In the economic calculation debate, classical liberal Friedrich Hayek argued that a socialist command economy could not adequately transmit information about prices and productive quotas due to the lack of a price mechanism, and as a result it could not make rational economic decisions. Ludwig von Mises argued that a socialist economy was not possible at all, because of the impossibility of rational pricing of capital goods in a socialist economy since the state is the only owner of the capital goods. Hayek further argued that the social control over distribution of wealth and private property advocated by socialists cannot be achieved without reduced prosperity for the general populace, and a loss of political and economic freedoms.[54][55]
Hayek’s views were echoed by Winston Churchill in an electoral broadcast prior to the British general election of 1945:
. . . a socialist policy is abhorrent to the British ideas of freedom. Socialism is inseparably interwoven with totalitarianism and the object worship of the state. It will prescribe for every one where they are to work, what they are to work at, where they may go and what they may say. Socialism is an attack on the right to breathe freely. No socialist system can be established without a political police. They would have to fall back on some form of Gestapo, no doubt very humanely directed in the first instance.[56]”
If you want to read all of this check the link. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism
If you want to be really afraid of Socialism check out this link http://www.conservapedia.com/Socialism
Read and enjoy if it makes you all warm and fuzzy let us know, if not be afraid, very afraid.
Chris B
Sheesh… Bryan, I was wondering who the “other guy” was (besides myself) that actually read and studied the Homeowner Affordability and Stability Plan …props to you, an impressive elucidation.
For the readers: Although the entire scope of the plan and more importantly the inevitable effects and the motivations behind the so called solutions it “provides” can’t be summed up and interpreted in a few paragraphs as Bryan did….he still comes darn close to the truth of it.
Im the farthest thing from a conspiracy theorist however as a person who has a deep understanding of the Homeowner Affordability and Stability Plan I only have a few things to add to Bryan’s post…
1st The long term effects of this legislation on American taxpayers are FAR FAR worse than Bryan depicts. Too much to detail here so just trust me on that one.
2nd The short term AND long term effect of loan mods and the reduction of principal owed to meet certain “affordability targets” will grossly skew true market value for years to come, thereby perpetuating this housing dilema and creating a new one.
Lastly, in “their” attempt to help “they” have now created an very strong incentive for even those who do not want to or need to modify their existing mortgage a “must participate situation”….(If everyone on your street modifys thier loan and gets their principal reduced ….would YOU stand on principal and not do the same? Doubtful.)
In effect, in “their” attempts to “help” they potentially created (in my opinion) a more severe and further reaching crisis that will span a generation or more. I feel this, of course, was intended. Or maybe they are just idiots. But I dont think they are.
As Bryan said and I will reinforce…This is marxism by definition since the Government is holding the purse strings on this one and through their legislation sought to (1st) destroy and then influence and control the one true capitalistic market we have.
“They” of couse will say “you still have a choice to not participate” …I say you clearly do not.
I have to disagree… why was there NO OUTRAGE when we bailed the banks out, and they used the money unwisely..but now everyone is fussing when they help out the little guy..
My family is one that will hopefully be assisted by the Presidents new plan.
And my I start off by saying that we DID NOT buy more house than we could afford… we are Self Employed individuals whose business has all but tanked because of the Recession.
The ONLY loan that we could get that was affordable because we were self employed, (and as self employed individuals, they treat you as though you have the plague)…..was an adjustable rate mortgage….yes we could have utilized a fixed rate loan, but the Interest Rate would have been OUTRAGEOUS because of our self employed status.
Our payments (even after our rates adjusted) would have been affordable to us, BUT…. then the economy tanked, and since we service the Housing Industry… we were hit first and the hardest.
People on Wall Street can stand and do their television rants, but until they are just a plain old “Mom and Pop” industry, that trusts in the system that left us down because it is so riddled with Greed, and Corruption…… they should not speak until they realize that there are MANY FAMILIES just like us, that are hard working, trusting in the system, and just wanting to feed their families….
I am PERSONALLY OFFENDED whenever I hear someone on TV who is as far removed from “Main Street” as you can get….ranting and raving about how they are paying for their neighbors mortgage…. why are they not complaining about the Corruption and Greed on the part of the banks?????????
The ONLY way that this Economy is going to turn around is if the housing industry comes back full force….. until then…. you wil see more companies closing, and unemployment reaching 10%.
So please realize that there are MANY SHADES of Grey where this Housing situation is.
I would much rather help the Policemen, and Teachers, and Nurses, and Self Employed Individuals like myself, than the Fat Cats at the Bank…. so please do not Generalize, there are many hardworking people who just wanted a home….
OR like us…. needed to pay Medical Bills for a Sick Family member…. (since Insurance was too expensive for us when we were just starting out)…… and we refinanced thinking that we were doing the right thing.
There is a little saying, Please do NOT judge, until you walk a mile in a mans shoes….I have to agree with that!!!
respectfully
Lisa
Sorry, Bryan, I do not agree with much of what you write.
Admittedly, it looks bad and smells bad to have mortgages modified and worse to have modifications imposed on lenders. But what you forget is that this is like a forest fire, destroying America as surely as neighborhoods and cities are destroyed by widespread fires or flooding. If we left it to homeowners to buy fire services in advance, or build protective dikes around their own homes, we’d have islands of survival in swaths of destruction.
We have learned that the fire next door is a huge threat to us, and if we as communities don’t ensure an adequate response, all may be lost.
When it was spendthrifts who overbought or treated their homes like ATMs to finance their vacat9ons, cogent arguments about moral hazard made sense, but today what we have is prudent people who put big money down on fixed-rate mortgages they could afford being wiped out because their communities and cities are turning into deserts of devastation, littered with vacant foreclosures quickly deteriorating due to inattention, vagrant, vandals and squatters.
We could say these people whose equity has been wiped out and may now be substantially under water must grin and bear it. We could say they signed a loan agreement and need to live up to it or be ruined for the rest of their lives, but clearly this is a disaster not of their own making. The banks and other lenders created this entire financial collapse and are at least equally to blame and need to shoulder their part of the cost.
Don’t tell me that a homeowner who paid $500,000 for a home three years ago and put up life savings of $100,000 as a down payment were imprudent and deserve to face another 27 years of payments on a $400,000 mortgage when the banks are selling identical foreclosures in the same block for $300,000 or less! I have been writing on my own blog for more than a year that lenders are fouling their own nests by thoughtlessly throwing people out on the streets and letting their homes fall into ruin, thus reducing the resale value of every other home within blocks.
There are times when individual prudence and “looking out for Number One” are appropriate, and there are times when it is not. We as a society need to act smarter and tackle the big picture, making it more attractive to stay in homes, writing off parts of loans in exchange for a share of profits on future resale, giving judges the same rights to modify home loans as they already have on all other types of debt, and even if necessary disassembling those securitized mortgage pools that no one know how to run or regulate.
Some may call this socialism, but I am not afraid of that term, All it really means is that we as a society have rights and responsibilities that transcend the “me.” As a Vulcan would have said, “The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.”
There was a time when all those functions which we take for granted are public responsibilities today — defense, education, police and fire protection, road construction — were individual, family or clan responsibility. We need look no further than the Congo, Iraq, Pakistan, Somalia — to see that a robust and powerful common response to generalized problems is far more effective (and far less destructive) than the rugged individualism being promoted by libertarian and right-wing Republicans today.
I say this as an active capitalist and real-estate investor: Social responsibility requires that we not only look after our own interests but those of our neighbors, even if we disagree with some of the choices they made. I applaud President Obama for doing something — anything! — to get the financial and credit systems functioning before we are all pulled down into the whirlpool generated by the last decade or two.
Once again Bryan you are spot on with your analogy of the latest plan of the Non Citizen Hussein that currently is occupying the White House. He and his half baked bunch of THIEVES have but one thing in mind and that is to completely destroy the Capitalist economy system that has worked in our country extremely well for over two hundred years.
Those that wish to know the next move on the Hussein the Non Citizen’s agenda pick up a copy of the book “Rules for Radicals” by Saul Alinsky you will be astounded at what you read and you will see that every move that Hussein the Non Citizen is making comes straight from the pages of the book. Get the BOOK, READ the BOOK and when you do you will be GET MAD AS HELL!! THEN JOIN THE REST OF US AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS IDIOT before we are pushed completely over the cliff !
To follow is the last letter I sent to my Senators and the Representative form the state I reside in before the senate was to vote on the last SOCIAL SPENDING ORGY THAT WAS JUST RAMMED DOWN OUR THROATS. I encourage each and every reader of this comment to send similar letters to their congressional representatives. The TIME HAS COME FOR “WE THE PEOPLE” to TAKE OUR COUNTRY BACK!!!
Senator,
As your constituent, I urge you to reject H.R.1, the so-called “Stimulus” bill. This so called ‘compromise’, is far from improving the already bad bill, the “compromise” is actually worse than the original bill. This bill would be more appropriately named if it were called the Obama, Pelosi, Reid Socialist theft act of 2009. There are those of us that do not wish to rename our country as the United Socialist States of America, I trust you are one of them.
This Spending Bill that is to provide TAX Relief to the TAX PAYER does nothing of the sort. Instead of providing real tax cuts that would return money to the taxpayer who could then in turn spend the money to give the economy a real boost again does nothing of the sort. This latest version of the bill actually reduces the meager, temporary tax credits in the bills passed by the House and Senate originally.
These so called “shovel-ready” highway projects we have heard so much about are but a tiny portion of this bill, that should not be part of this bill or any bill for that matter in my opinion. Actually those states that need infrastructure repairs should take care of those repairs through the respective states tax dollars not the US government! The infrastructure is already there and only needs to be maintained. Instead we see billions of dollars to expand existing bureaucratic programs, $300 million for federal employee company cars, wear the cars out first, these people do not need new cars, my car has 125000 miles on it and I am unable to buy a new car because the banks are out of the lending business even though the banks were bailed out with the CITIZENS Tax Payer dollars so tell me why the government employees should have new cars at the TAX PAYERS expense with this new SPENDING BILL that provides NO RELIEF to the CITIZENS of the United States. Then there is $165 million for fish hatcheries and dozens upon dozens of other pet projects that do nothing to stimulate the economy.
Now lets look at the hidden provision to create a health board that is not necessary or needed however this board hidden under the guise of a Comparative Effective Research Council which will set the stage for a health rationing board long advocated by the man who was to be the nation’s health “Czar,” Tom “I couldn’t tell the truth if I had to” Daschle, and provisions that allow the states to weaken work requirements in the 1996 Welfare Reform bill. The US government needs to GET OUT of the health care business and leave this to people that know what they are doing!!
All in all the only way to stimulate this economy is to CUT TAXES!! The US Government is fast approaching the end of it’s usefulness and in my opinion already has. In order for the US government to begin being useful to the CITIZENS of the United States once again, here is a novel idea that WILL WORK!! CUT the Corporate TAX rate to 8% making it the lowest in the world and make the cut Permanent, then CUT the Capital Gains TAX rate to ZERO and make that cut Permanent!! Cut the individual tax rate to 8% for every Citizen (take note I said CITIZEN, this means get the ILLEGAL ALIENS OUT!!!) and make the CUT Permanent!! No new taxes or tax increases of any sort to the Citizens of the United States for any reason whatsoever!!
By doing these simple such logical things the 535 self appointed Napoleons currently in Washington along with the Non Citizen occupying the White House would be able to watch money come to the United States not by the truck load but by the SHIP LOAD!! Additionally if the 535 self appointed Napoleons along with the Non Citizen occupying the White House would simply get out of the way of the United States CITIZENS by staying out of the oil business, out of the energy business, out of the banking business, out of the automobile business, out of the healthcare business, out of the insurance business and out of the education business this country as a whole would be much better off than she is today!
Simply put the US government needs to STAY OUT OF THE UNITED STATES CITIZENS BUSINESS COMPLETELY and do what the US government was formed to do which is to protect the borders of our country nothing more and nothing less!!
The truth is the CITIZENS of the United States have HAD IT WITH THE SELF APPOINTED NAPOLEONS!! Take note there is an uprising brewing throughout the country and the sooner the what are supposed to be leaders listen to the CITIZENS of the United States the sooner this uprising will be thwarted!! Otherwise this fast moving and fast growing uprising will become an unstopable force that the 535 Self Appointed Napoleons do not want to deal with. This means STOP the Self Serving Napoleonic Ways and listen to the CITIZENS of the UNITED STATES we are telling you what we want and what is best for our country however the 535 Self Appointed Napoleons are not listening!!
Additionally the vote on this bill violates the pledge by congressional liars (I mean leaders) to allow 48 hours after publication of the bill before a vote.
Now I am asking you to Please vote “NO” on the conference report on H.R.1, the “Stimulus” bill that would be more appropriately titled as the Obama, Pelosi, Reid Socialist theft act of 2009.
PS.
Realizing that the excoriating comments and concerns contained in this letter may have offended you and if so I do apologize the comments and concerns are not directed at you, as you have done your job by representing my conservative principals and values. The excoriating comments and concerns are actually directed at your democrat associates so please you are encouraged to share this with all your democrat associates.
PSS.
There is a movement for Texas to secede from the union that I personally support and I feel very strongly that Texas should secede from the what are currently called the United States of America. The Citizens of Texas do not wish or need to be apart of the United Socialist States of America. Texas is an independent Republic that has the capability and ability to handle her own problems without the meddling of the United Socialist States of America and the Non Citizen in the White House who wishes to turn what was once the only true free country in the world into a Socialist Hell Hole like all the rest of the Socialist countries around the world. Personally I am NOT INTERESTED in such NONSENSE!! Texas has the ability and the will to be the FREE REPUBLIC that America once was.
Do the right thing VOTE NO!!!! God Bless you,
Darold Reimer God Loving Patriot 1st, Conservative 2nd, Republican 3rd
Actually I think someone ought to be prosecuting lenders who made all these idiotic loans to people who couldn’t afford them and
homeowners who signed mortgages without reading it and knowing what the heck they were signing ( or knowing they couldn’t afford it)ought to have to pay for what they’ve signed for and
all those who jacked up home prices way beyond what is reasonable for the work and materials going into them ought to have their greedy butts kicked!
Why doesn’t the gov’t just roll home prices back to “normal” instead of letting the market bottom out? Just set a current market value on real estate that is reasonable and fair and start over if they insist on sticking their noses in private business??
Chris,
Just like Bryan, you don’t know what you’re talking about. Thank you for the definitions of Mortgage Brokers and Loan Servicers. I’m not sure why you provided that information, but thank you just the same.
Here is where you are wrong: Most big lenders DO service the loans that they originate. Fannie and Freddie don’t exist to service loans. They do service loans, but they are in the business of buying secondary mortages. When a large lender sells a loan portfolio to Fannie or Freddie, they usually retain the servicing. It’s not always a package deal. Servicing is very lucrative. They will usually sell the loan, but keep the servicing for themselves.
Mortgage brokers aren’t investors, so I’m not sure why you brought them up. They are only middle men that broker loans on the behalf of investors. The don’t sell loans either, because they aren’t their loans to begin with. You are probably confusing mortgage brokers with mortgage banks.
To all of you that call me racist, or insist that I’m playing the race card, please show me one post where I have done so. Just one!
How about 6 or 7 of them? Here are some posts where you were the first to interject race, or the only one to continue harping on it, when it was peripheral to the content of the post:
http://realestate.bryanellis.com/521/two-weeks-from-election/#comment-2778
http://realestate.bryanellis.com/362/better-for-investors-mccain-or-obama/#comment-2024
http://realestate.bryanellis.com/362/better-for-investors-mccain-or-obama/#comment-2016
http://realestate.bryanellis.com/362/better-for-investors-mccain-or-obama/#comment-1880
http://realestate.bryanellis.com/362/better-for-investors-mccain-or-obama/#comment-1838
http://realestate.bryanellis.com/362/better-for-investors-mccain-or-obama/#comment-1830
http://realestate.bryanellis.com/362/better-for-investors-mccain-or-obama/#comment-1820
Facts are cruel things. — Bryan Ellis
The problem is, anytime I mentioned the fact that Obama was a Black man, people accused me of playing the race card. I was merely stating the obvious.
I think you should point the racist fingers at yourselves. In this article alone, Bryan has referred to the current President as stupid, arrogant, foolish and idiotic. Most of you have agreed with him. Where does all of this anger and disgust come from? Where was all of this anger and disguest when Bush 43 was flushing the country down the toilet? How can anyone that voted for Bush 43 twice (TWICE!), call Obama an idiot?
Bush ran roughshod over this country for eight years, and he and his cronies stole every penny they could from us. And now that Obama is trying to put some of that money back into our hands, you call him a fool? You have the nerve to be angry and disgusted because our President is trying to keep people from losing their homes, but you sat by while Bush sent our soldiers to attack a country that presented no present danger to us? The cost of this war dwarfs the size of the stimulus plan, but where is your anger and disgust over that?
I’m angry and disgusted that Bush gave big tax breaks to large corporations, only so they could then send jobs overseas. I’m angry and disgusted that thousands of people in New Orleans suffered and died, while Bush stood by and watched. I’m angry and disgusted that Bush put my country at war, only so he could blow up Iraq, and then issue no bid contracts to his cronies to rebuild it.
Maybe what Obama is doing is right, maybe it isn’t. But whatever he’s doing, he’s doing it for ALL of the people of this country. Bush never did anything for anyone but himself and those that are rich like him. Capitalism has it’s benefits, but it mainly benefits those that are rich and already in power. My interests, and apparently those of our President, are more inclusive than that.
Wow. You completely lack conviction, don’t you? “Maybe what Obama is doing is right, maybe it isn’t.” Is that the extent of your concern with his policies? It appears so. You’ve beaten your own argument: To you, the criteria that matters is whether policy effects everybody, and not whether it’s the right policy. This does not speak well of you. — Bryan Ellis
Anthony,
I have no trouble understanding that you do not understand most of what I wrote or why.
I also understand why you do not understand why people would think the way they do about many of the the things you write.
I also understand why many people like yourself, (I interpet you as a liberal democrat) would have a hard time quoting facts and do not really trouble yourself with taking the time to read facts.
I worked for both the DNC and the RNC in my life and while they both are pretty crappy outfits to have any dealing with, the DNC is the most self-serving but of assholes I have ever met in my life.
While some of the problems can be traced back to the Republicans at different times in our history, and I have mentioned some of the worst offenders, most of the worst problems can be traced to the Democrats.
Bush had little to do with what has happened, just like Obama will have little to do with the current Socialist agenda in operation. The Congress is much more responsible and if they had any sense of Patriotism they would really do something about the crimes lodged against us by previous terms of Congress.
Read the information on Socialism I have previously posted, read some information Capitalism, read about Redlining. Tell me some of the big banks that you say service their own loans. I can tell you Citi, BofA, Wells Fargo, Chase do not service their own loans. B of A doesn’t even have a human resource department. Where do get some of the ideas you have? I am all for ideas but I have little truck with ideas not supported by facts and I don’t means lies told by some political hack or the total crap from the so called main stream media that wouldn’t know the truth if it bit them on the butt.
So read all the information and look at some of the facts.
Chris B
Bryan, thanks for listing all of my posts. That is much appreciated. Now please show me the comments in those posts where I “played the race card”, or made racists comments. You’re not trying to say that by merely mentioning race in a conversation, that I am guilty of playing the card card. Or are you?
Sounds paranoid to me…
To my esteemed readers: This reader has a difficulty in that he can’t see past race, as the partial listing of his comments above reveals. If he was to have a look at any of the posts above, he’ll see that he is, in every case, the person who either introduced race into non-racial conversations or extended non-race-oriented discussions towards the direction of race. I’m sorry, but that doesn’t pass muster around here. I’m not bound by the garbage of political correctness, and I don’t mind pointing it out: Much to the regret of us all, virtually all of this reader’s focus is on racial issues, as he insists on bringing race into virtually every discussion. That is the very definition of “playing the race card”. Frankly, I would think it insulting to anybody sensitive to racial issues - including me - that Anthony’s basis for decision and argument appear to be largely about race, even with issue completely unrelated to race. A sad state of affairs indeed. — Bryan Ellis
bryan,
i believe rush limbaugh and sean hannity would not call themselves racist but …..
you have been on this mission before obama took office. i don’t recall this trend when the other guy who got us in this mess being mentioned. i use to enjoy your message but now it’s like reading an email from the local kkk.
Where do I begin ? I will begin by saying I have read every post on this blog and I will thank Bryan for making this forum available to us all to speak our minds, well those of us that have a mind.
misslinda2000 my dear you are very misguided in your thoughts so much so that the only word I have to describe you is idiot, you are simply another of the mindless dolts that feel as though the world is fair and everyone should have the same. Well misslinda2000 whoever told you that life is fair LIED!! and the world owes you the same as the world owes me NOTHING!! Realizing that you voted for the NON CITIZEN that is currently occupying the White House would it be safe to say that you are a NON CITIZEN as well? Given that you are supporting the Socialization of the Greatest Nation the world has ever seen or ever will see this seems rather obvious to me. misslinda2000 contrary to what Hussein has lied to you and 305 million other people about in the United States not to mention the over 6 billion people that comprise the populous of the world having health insurance, going to college, having a mortgage on a house you cannot afford and taking money out of my pocket to take care of you is not a right or an entitlement. The United States Constitution does not state any of these things as rights or entitlements. Rather than wait on Hussein to bail you out how about you get off your assets and go to work and take care of yourself. God states in the Bible, (now I know I am speaking Greek to you) that “those that do not work should not eat.” I suggest you read the play book your messiah is reading from. “Rules for Radicals” by the Communist activist Saul Alinsky that is if you are able to comprehend the Marxist Communist ideology that he espouses in the book. Your messiah is using this book to herd the people of the United States over the Socialist cliff. misslinda2000 I will get off of you now and move on to the next mindless dolt that has no idea what the true power of a Capitalist Society is all about.
cmga64 who claims to have lived in a Socialist society which based on the comments made is very doubtful if not a flat out lie. cmga64 do you want someone telling where you have to work and what you have to do on the job that you are to perform? Do you want someone telling you what you may have to eat or may not eat? Do you want someone telling you where you must live because they said so? Do you want a government bureaucracy telling you that you are to old to receive a medical procedure that would keep you alive another 10 years because you are not worth the expense? Do you realize that even if you are 20 years old and suffering with a cancer could be arrested that a government bureaucracy will decide when and if you are able to seek medical attention for that condition? Do you mindless half wits realize what you are asking for? Be careful what you ask for you may just get it and 99.99% of the time what you asked for is really not what you wanted. The rich in this country continue to get rich because they use the laws that are written to their advantage the same as you mindless dolts could do if you only would take the time to gain the knowledge to do so. However I do realize that sitting around in your underwear crying and whining that the rich keep getting richer and I keep getting poorer is easier and besides Hussein will bail me out. There is a reason for this, the reason is called LAZY and I want my ENTITLEMENT the world OWES ME and I want everything for nothing. What is wrong with work cmga64? Oh you mean I actually have to do something to get something? Why yes what a novel concept that is. cmga64 if you are so enamored with that Socialist country you claim you lived in and left how about you and all the rest of the Lib’s that have made post on this blog board a plane to that Socialist country (there is one that leaves every two minutes) and never return. Trust me; we patriots will not miss you not even a little.
Now lets move onto Mr. Bursten, Mr Bursten you sound as though you are in the same category as the two I have just excoriated for their ridiculous views that millions that do have their priorities straight and their thinking right should bail out those that have made poor decisions. Sir life is a series of choices in which one will make good choices and bad choices and with any choice one makes comes consequences. Granted Uncle Sucker certainly passed some really STUPID legislation with the community reinvestment act of 1978 (which would have been better named the community give away act of 1978) signed into law by a TRAITOR named Jimmy “I am a DUMB ASS PEANUT FARMER” Carter which sir you are witnessing the second term of that disaster right now. However this disaster is being created and orchestrated by a very shrewd and intelligent NON CITIZEN USURPER and a cabinet, house and senate of bought off thieves cheats and liars that have lulled you into thinking that government is the answer to your problems. Well in the words of the greatest and best president this country has ever seen or ever will see Ronald Reagan. “The people turn to the government to solve their problems failing to realize that government is the problem” as well he stated “Be afraid when someone shows up at you door and says I’m from the government and I’m here to help you” any of this sinking in McFly? Mr. Bursten you could not be a real estate investor and if you are you must be starving to death otherwise the statements you made about writing down principal balances would be infuriating you. Suppose and I know this is likely a stretch for you but stay with me here. You hold a note on a home that you sold for 200,000.00 and you are acting as the bank and owner financing the property at say 9% simple interest amortized over 30 years. Now you paid 150,000.00 for the property and are looking forward to the tidy profit of 50,000.00 plus the interest at the end of the mortgage loan you so graciously made to a person that willingly and without duress signed that mortgage loan document and are paying their mortgage on time. Then Hussein the NON CITIZEN comes in and states Mr. Bursten you have not a choice in our decision to modify this persons mortgage and what we are going to do is cut the interest rate in half from 9% to 4.5% and because of declining values (due to the blunders of good ole Uncle Sucker) we are also going to write down the principal on this loan from 200,000.00 to 130,000.00. Now tell me Mr Bursten how is this going to help your bottom line? Well lets see, by Hussein and his band of thieves doing this you will loose a little over 100,000.00 in interest not to mention the tidy little profit of 50,000.00 oh lets not forget you are now 20,000.00 underwater on the house you paid 150,000.00 for. All in all Hussein and his band of thieves have just legally stole 170,000.00 from you. Does this seem like a good scenario to you Mr. Bursten? How does it feel to have just been ripped off for 170,000.00 by a NON CITIZEN and a band of USURPING THIEVES? You like this Mr. Bursten you’re an IDIOT!
Finally on to some good news WGReau you and I are on the same page concerning taking our country back from a NON CITIZEN and his band of USURPING THIEVES!
SANDOR OCHOA how right you are we have history staring us right in the face and recent history to make matters worse and for whatever reason our country is full of mindless dolts that would rather have Uncle Sucker tell them how to live their lives than to take responsibility and accountability for their own lives.
Mr. McMullin like you I was born with a plastic spoon in my mouth and have worked for everything that I have never expecting a hand out for anything. The only thing I ever asked for was the opportunity that God gave me the United States Constitution states every man has available to him that lives in the United States. Unfortunate but true also Dr. King was used as a pawn in this past what was called an election and I think I would be safe in saying Dr. King would be very very disappointed in the turnout of this what was supposed to be an election.
Chris as always you are right on point and right on the money with what you have stated. Nice to know that some of us are truly well informed and do actually know what we are stating and why we are stating what we have stated. Brian 2825 you fit right in here with Chris right on the money good job calling this piece of garbage what it is garbage.
Darold Reimer God Loving Patriot 1st, Conservative 2nd and Republican 3rd
Bryan,
So much pontification over so short a post. My turn. Please forgive if I speak in general terms, not specifics. And Bryan is welcome to edit any and all of this post since this is his PRIVATE blog.
First, this is the down part of an economic cycle. Any attempt to force a change of the natural direction of that cycle before it has run its course is naïve, expensive, and futile. Just my opinion.
Not having read the proposed policy I have to take what Bryan said at face value. It seems that the “investors” (lenders, Freddie, Fannie,…) will have reduced returns on their note investments from the loan mods. This increases the financial pressure on an already shaky industry which could lead to more “bailouts” of note holders (investors) in the future. Where do you draw the line?
To the political rantors, some of you speak of the executive branch as if it is omnipotent and wholly responsible for the current panic. The legislators, who were asleep on watch while housing prices were rising faster that wages, are still in office. Tell them to stop spending your money trying to fix something that cannot be fixed or get them voted out of office. The American citizens are the true leaders of this country. The “leaders” in D.C. are only our representatives. And they are doing a lousy job right now.
Come to think of it, I have heard several times in the past that talking about politics or religion at social gatherings is pointless. Everyone believes their opinion is the only right way to think and will not change that opinion, regardless of how much you argue with or yell at them. I say that because it seems that a previous post author had something against Obama for being a member of a Baptist church (am I correct with that?) in Chicago.
Oh Anthony. I remember a quote that said “better to remain silent and let everybody believe that you are an idiot than to open your mouth and prove them right.” After having said that, I must agree with two things. 1) Loan servicing is a lucrative business. There are several companies in this country whose sole business is just that. 2) Loan originators MAY service the loans they write. That does not mean that they still own those loans after selling the ‘conforming’ loans to Freddie or Fannie and the ‘non-conforming’ loans to other investors. If loan servicing is an income stream then that income stream can also be sold to someone else.
Think about it, a mortgage company (MC) writes a loan making money on the loan fees and points. Then it sells the loan to Freddie at more than par, making more money (you think the loan will be sold for less than it is worth?) Then selling the servicing to another company making still more money. What does the MC have left? No obligations or responsibilities and a lot more money to write more loans to sell to… (The cycle continues.) That was learned by observation, not from working in any company!
Finally Anthony, you want your rants posted? Try melding your message to the audience, not the audience to your message. Or start your own blog.
Off the soapbox now.
OK, so I pulled the following right off of your website Bryan:
I’m Bryan Ellis, and I really don’t know very much about anything. But for some reason, people continue to offer me tidy sums of money for my advice on internet marketing, real estate investing and public speaking/sales strategies.
Today you need to stick to internet marketing, real estate investing and public speaking/sales strategies.
You are misinforming your readers big time. Here are the facts:
1. Servicers will receive an up-front fee of $1,000 for each eligible modification meeting guidelines established under this initiative. Servicers will also receive “pay for success” fees – awarded monthly as long as the borrower stays current on the loan – of up to $1,000 each year for three years. This is called the “Pay for Success” Incentive. I believe you misspelled it as “bribe”. No need to apologize.
2. Because loan modifications are more likely to succeed if they are made before a borrower misses a payment, the plan will include an incentive payment of $1,500 to mortgage holders and $500 for servicers for modifications made while a borrower at risk of imminent default is still current. This is called a Responsible Modification Incentive.
No where in the plan does it say “Bribe Borrowers to unnecessarily modify mortgages by giving them $1,500 if they have their mortgage modified before they are in default!!!!!! No need to apologize!
3. Anthony is 100% correct. Your article is not accurate. Here you should apologize. I think he’s been a good sport.
To Chris B,
I don’t pretend to know what it’s like to have worked for the DNC or the RNC. You shouldn’t pretend to know about mortgage brokers, GSEs, loan servicers or anything mortgage related just because you have 3 friends who work for big banks. So, you should take some of your own advice and “read all the information and look at some of the facts” before you attempt to put someone like Anthony in his place. By the way, he wrote that he worked at one of the GSEs and in case you didn’t know, that’s Fannie or Freddie. So I’m fairly confident he knows what he’s talking about.
Brian; I really liked your webinar with Sal Buscemi the other night- it was one of the most informative I’ve heard in the RE arena yet and I’ve heard quite a few.
Your blog however has digressed into negative political banter that, while I agree Obamas offering is not the solution that will work, neither will the atmosphere on this blog. People are pissed and looking for flesh. Almost EVERONE is more committed to blaming and bitching rather then offering constructive suggestions.
And here is the real kicker:
Banks don’t make loans- read the Chicago’s Federal Reserves document(might be hard to find) the”Two Faces of Debt”.
Except maybe for private funding, banks ‘Monetize’ the note(all notes- the promise to pay) and have no real assets into the deal. In fact according to Federal Reserves corporate charter, banks cannot loan depositors balances. Through fractional reserve lending policies they inflate their balance sheet by a ratio of 10 to 1 at this point in the casino game by creating more ‘loans’.
So, where are the losses that the banks claim to have if they never had any SKIN in the game as you say??? Ask Sal Buscemi, when on the webinar the other night if he meant what he said when he likes to ‘lean’ on the bank when negotiating the bulk purchases…..why is that?… does he know something about the real banking practices that most don’t or better yet won’t comment on? Ask any attorney who has their head removed from their you know what long enough if there is any legal consideration in the deal of the ‘loans’ that banks make! Try going into your bank with perfect credit and offer to fill out a ‘loan’ agreement and when it comes to signing the ‘commercial instrument’- sign your name and by your name sign “all rights reserved” they will not approve your ‘loan’. Why? Maybe because your’re putting them on notice to fully disclose the terms of the contract- which they do not otherwise- so they will not approve the deal.
The system is rotten to the core- and most people do not have the correct information to begin to understand how they have been used and how complicit/co-conspiring the government has been in allowing this ’system’ to foster since 1914- but they feel it and they’re pissed…..
People living in houses that they can’t afford is not right and stupid - and doing that in a system that ‘loans money’ created on the borrowers signature at interest while the at the same time the money needed to pay back the interest is unavailable unless that is ‘loaned’ into existence as well is down right fraudulent , and has in it racketeering, illegal conversion, collusion and list goes on. Great combo: stupid,irresponsible,spoiled,co-dependent,unemployed homeowner/slave is in a deal with a corrupt,hell bent,manipulative,lying,debt paper printing, property stealer.
If you want to bring this sh…. up on your blog you may/better go all the way and talk plainly and talk solutions.
James, you stated that I was a blind fool for my remarks. However, all I read from you was name calling of others and negative remarks about the current administration. I heard not one good idea coming from you. So let us analyse for a moment your useful thoughts and general understanding of what is going on, Oh I’m sorry, you obviously have none, not a clue. As far as Obama supporters being blind, foolish and ignorant, this I say, more likely fits people such as yourself. You are the ones whom agreed with the last eight years of government in this country. You sir are a bafoon, I just hope your are in a position to not be negatively affected by the current situation. I hope you have a job you can rely on, a home that has not lost a significant amount of equity, and a 401k that has not lost at least 30% of its value. You see, I just described the situation of better than half the working population in this countyr today. So yes, I will give you a break as you requested, because you are the blind fool. One more thing, you really should learn the true meaning of socialism.
Bryan, I am not an expert on market cycles but from what little I have learned especially about major depressions is when people or the government doesn’t get involved it can get really bad. The great depression in the 20-30’s is my major reference. During that period it was the goverments stand to let the market fix itself. Well we all know how that turned out. I think our govermental leaders all have reference to what happened during that period thats probably why they are trying to be proactive. What they are doing maybe doesn’t seem beneficial or smart but what we don’t know is it might be saving our country from going deeper into depression and that would not be good for any of us. All we can do is have faith they are doing their best and faith that God will protect us and in the meantime do all we can to help the situation not make it worse.
God Bless You and Your Family
I find Bryan’s original comments that started this thread to be bordering on hysteria. Socialism! The sky is falling! Run for your life! But the posts concerning the social fallout of not doing something are much more thoughtful and, dare I say it, inspiring. This is the freakin’ United States of America. We are capable of better than where and what we are today. It is going to cost money. Get over it.
The post with the essay defining socialism was thought provoking as well but seems to be based on the fear of where the author sees us heading. Here is another definition worth consideration.
“Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power.” - Benito Mussolini.
For those of you who do not recognize this I refer you to the last eight years under 43. If you think this is or has been a good thing I respectfully invite you to pull your head out from where ever it is embedded.
Shalom,
Ken
Obama’s no fool, Bryan. He and his co=conspirators on the left know EXACTLY what they’re doing. This is all part of their agenda. Elections have consequences,insidious ones too.
Darold Reimer, I want to thank you, thank you and thank you again. You saved me a lot of time and effort in addressing some the beyond silly comments by: misslinda2000; reloanpro; cmga64; and tuesdaysmom1.
You misslinda2000, based on the comments in both of your post, you demonstrate either disdain for or a total lack of understanding for the Constitution, or could it be both? In addition to absolutely no concept of economics…there is no FREE LUNCH! You want change? It looks as though you will certainly get it, the problem is all of us will have to deal with this unwelcomed burden of monumental debt that will be the result of you and all of the other folks in this country who now feel entitled to stick your hands in the pockets of posterity.
You mentioned health care in both post. If you took the time to read some of the 1,100 pages of the “PORKULUS BILL” that your “SAVIOR” rammed thru Congress, you will find the “TROJAN HORSE” that will be the start of the health coverage you seek so much. I find it absolutely abhorrent what the socialist in Congress, masquerading as Democrats have planned for the health care you so desire. Be careful what you ask from gov’t, you are most likely to get more than you want. Ever heard of the adage, “the devil is in the details?”
Darold Reimer mentioned it in one of his post, but just in case you missed that important nugget, here it is again.
During the presidential campaign, Obama proposed the creation of an institute that would judge the “comparative effectiveness” of medical treatments, procedures, and therapies, as well as drugs, devices, and technologies. Now Nobama didn’t come up with this on his own, no, he had some help from another “control freak,” Tom, “I am not a lobbyist” Daschle. Did you know all medical records have to be computerized as a result of the passage of that bill? Now a new bureaucracy will be created, the National Coordinator of Health Information Technology. And the porkulus bill calls for the Federal Coordinating Council for Comparative Effectiveness Research. Daschle explained the purpose of this in his book, it is to slow the development and use of new medications and technologies because they are driving up costs.
Daschle says senior citizens “should be more accepting of the conditions that come with age,” instead of trying to have them treated. Oh, isn’t Mr. Daschle compassionate? In other words misslinda2000, old people should except their ailments and go away and die! “Medicare now pays for treatments deemed safe and effective. The porkulus bill changes this and applies a cost-effectiveness standard set by the Federal Council. The Federal Council is modeled after a UK board discussed in Daschle’s book. This board approves or rejects treatments using a formula that divides the cost of the treatment by the number of years the patient is likely to benefit. Treatments for younger patients are more often approved than treatments for diseases that affect the elderly, such as osteoporosis. You’ll get your health care, is this really the kind of health care you want? Do you really want some bureaucrats in DC making medical decisions that are better left to you and your doctor? Well, those days are soon to be over…is this the kind of health care you want? You wanted it and it’s coming to a doctor near you….These are the same pencil neck geeks that run all of the other many levels government we all love and enjoy the wonderful level of service we get.
The currect tax system and the IRS was first sold to the masses as a soak the rich campaign and it was only going to be at a measly 1%.
“Those that refuse to learn from history are dangerous.” Thats my quote.
If you don’t understand the argument agianst the bail out, it is because you don’t understand the economics of what that kind of spending can do to a country and its economy.
“YES WE CAN” Do you know where that comes from? Ever heard of Cha Guevara? That phrase was used by him, and we all know what an ANGEL he was.
tuesdaysmom1, (Lisa) There was plenty of outrage during the debate prior to the passage of that bill to bail out banks. In fact, the outrage was overwhelming against the passage. But I guess since it was a Republican in the White House at the time, you did not hear the outrage. It appears you only hear the outrage when it’s your guy in office.Those of us that are opposed to this new round of spending, we were just as outraged then as we are now. Doesn’t matter who is in the White House, a bail out is a bail out.
reloanpro: The above comments about the bail out, please ready them. And I want to correct you on the amount of the Bush/Paulson bank bail out, it was not trillions of dollars. On October 3, 2008, Congress passed the first pork bill in the amount of 700 million. They only passed out about half of it, Nobama requested Bush to free up the remainder before he left office.
misslinda2000 and cmga64 are you two neighbors? You seam to be drinking from the same cup of KOOL AID.
cmga, may I ask what is your problem with rich people? You live in America, nothing keeps you from becoming rich. News flash to you, THERE IS A NEED FOR RICH PEOPLE. Broke people can do nothing for each other. Have you ever been gainfully employed by a broke person? NO you have not! There is plenty of information from the government you love so much, why don’t you source them for some facts before you scream about rich people not paying taxes. I know most liberals have a problem with facts, but I will leave you with a few facts about who really pays taxes in this country anyway.
This data is from IRS: Summary of Federal Individual Income Tax Data, 2006
(Updated July 2008) The most recent data I was able to find.
Top:
1% paid 39.9% of all Federal taxes
5% paid 60.1% of all Federal taxes
10% paid 70.1% of all Federal taxes
25% paid 86.3% of all Federal taxes
50% paid 97.01% of all Federal taxes
The bottom 50% PAID ONLY 2.99% of all Federal taxes
So cmga64, here are the facts from the IRS as to who really pays the taxes in this country. So please stop allowing the liberal socialist politicians to indoctrinate you with class warfare venom, their nonsense never stand up to close scrutiny. Now you have no reason to continue your drivel about taxes and rich people, that is unless you enjoy bitching, moaning and whining.
Anthony, you sir should step away from the medicine cabinet…wait, wait, I take that back, you should reach in the medicine cabinet and get a handfully of XANAX and swallow at once. You are wound up way too tight, take off your race tinted glasses.
I was happy to see a number of posters that have an understanding of the proper role of a limited government: gainsmore; WGReau; Chris; brain; James; RonR; Norm Hayek; Sandra Ochoa; Gloria; and Don Gianmini;
Those of you mentioned at the beginning of the post, I suggest you skip the next episode of American Idol and read the Constitution instead, but please get an understanding of it. It is the only thing that keeps the wolves in DC from eating you sheep for lunch.
Chaos
Back on point. What benefits, if any, come out of this proposal? All I see is that the loan servicers and any homeowners that meet the requirements get all the pluses out of the plan. The note/mortgage holder has to deal with the loan modifications being shoved at them without any say in the matter. Can the loan holders reject the loan mods if they don’t make any business sense to them?
I am game for an intelligent and enlightening discussion about the plan. Anyone care to join me?
profitbuilder,
I was pretty sure Anthony worked at Fannie or Freddie when he stated he worked GSE. Now this in itself tells one a lot if you thing about it.
As for my friends in the industries, they are more than 3 just so you know, just was thinking of 3 in particular at the time, you might ask yourself who the 3 are? I do a lot of fact research at all times. Are all facts included in every statement, do not think so. Do I like or respect Anthony or others like him, not really. Do they have a right to say what they want, sure do.
If you want facts then here is a fact! Most liberals will do everything but stay on track, will do anything except look at facts, will do anything to change the point, subject, talking point.
Here is a good fact by another famous liar president, “I never had sex with that woman”, while shaking his fingert at us. There is a liberal fact for you!
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